<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Eating Your Seed Corn</title>
	<atom:link href="http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/</link>
	<description>A Forum for Opinions on News, Politics, and Life</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 21:59:28 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Brianna</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8555</link>
		<dc:creator>Brianna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 14:57:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8555</guid>
		<description>Oh, good, somebody did get it besides me.  So I&#039;m probably not completely crazy.  Phew!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, good, somebody did get it besides me.  So I&#8217;m probably not completely crazy.  Phew!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Harvey</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8539</link>
		<dc:creator>Harvey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 04:05:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8539</guid>
		<description>Brianna,

That was a brilliant analogy! 

(Your last post reminds me of telling a joke and then having to explain the joke to those who didn&#039;t understand it -- it kind of spoils the joke!)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brianna,</p>
<p>That was a brilliant analogy! </p>
<p>(Your last post reminds me of telling a joke and then having to explain the joke to those who didn&#8217;t understand it &#8212; it kind of spoils the joke!)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Brianna</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8533</link>
		<dc:creator>Brianna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 01:30:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8533</guid>
		<description>&quot;Well, I’m still digesting the article (couldn’t resist the pun), and I’m not sure I see how the analogy works if money isn’t based on some commodity standard (like gold, or maybe corn).&quot;

Tom, the point of my article is this: money (no matter what it&#039;s form) stands for wealth, and wealth can be used for one of two things.  Either you can consume it, or you can invest it to produce more wealth.  As your infrastructure grows, so does both your net output of wealth and the amount of wealth needed to keep it going.  In order to stay level, a certain amount of that wealth *must* be used each year to maintain the infrastructure that created it.  In order to stay alive a certain amount of wealth *must* be consumed (in my story, literally; in real life, by exchanging symbolic pieces of paper for food).  The rest you can either consume or invest, and most societies usually choose to do a bit of both.  A recession can be caused by either a natural disaster which wipes out crops or infrastructure, by a literal loss of commodity money (such as when a ship of gold sank in 1857, which helped to precipitate the crash of that year), or both.  It can also be caused by bad government policy, like when the Fed kept interest rates artificially low in the 20&#039;s, thus facilitating over investment and bad investment which precipitated the crash of 1929 (that can happen in a free market too, btw, but it corrects itself more easily when it does).  But any way you cut it, a recession means that some wealth has been lost and that in order to preserve our infrastructure, we must save more wealth than usual and be very careful about how we allocate the wealth we do spend.  We should not, no matter what emotional appeals are made, spend that wealth in consumption because the lower we drive our net wealth, the less wealth we will have available for investment, and the harder this recession will be to get out of.

All money is based on the fact that there is a value (food, a house, a factory) in the market to back it up with.  Even gold wouldn&#039;t work in the middle of an empty plain; fiat money only works because people trust it to work as well as the real thing.  This is its downfall, because inevitably politicians will always use the fiat money system to pretend wealth that doesn&#039;t exist, and you can only cheat reality for so long before the world catches on and erupts into chaos.

If you look back into history you will see that the way governments have always paid for wars and spending programs by devaluing the money supply.  We did it in the Civil War, we did it when we created the Fed and the fractional reserve system and it caused the Depression, we did it again *during* the Depression when Roosevelt confiscated the nation&#039;s gold, we did it again when we abolished Bretton-Woods so we could inflate the money supply to pay for Vietnam and LBJ&#039;s &quot;Great Society&quot;, and we&#039;re doing it now in an attempt to cover our butts with the national debt from Iraq, Afghanistan, the housing insanity, the stimulus package, the bailouts, etc.  Having a fiat money supply is like telling the people in my allegory that they should attempt to replace their corn with sawdust, and eat that instead.  It might fill their stomachs for a while, but it won&#039;t work forever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Well, I’m still digesting the article (couldn’t resist the pun), and I’m not sure I see how the analogy works if money isn’t based on some commodity standard (like gold, or maybe corn).&#8221;</p>
<p>Tom, the point of my article is this: money (no matter what it&#8217;s form) stands for wealth, and wealth can be used for one of two things.  Either you can consume it, or you can invest it to produce more wealth.  As your infrastructure grows, so does both your net output of wealth and the amount of wealth needed to keep it going.  In order to stay level, a certain amount of that wealth *must* be used each year to maintain the infrastructure that created it.  In order to stay alive a certain amount of wealth *must* be consumed (in my story, literally; in real life, by exchanging symbolic pieces of paper for food).  The rest you can either consume or invest, and most societies usually choose to do a bit of both.  A recession can be caused by either a natural disaster which wipes out crops or infrastructure, by a literal loss of commodity money (such as when a ship of gold sank in 1857, which helped to precipitate the crash of that year), or both.  It can also be caused by bad government policy, like when the Fed kept interest rates artificially low in the 20&#8242;s, thus facilitating over investment and bad investment which precipitated the crash of 1929 (that can happen in a free market too, btw, but it corrects itself more easily when it does).  But any way you cut it, a recession means that some wealth has been lost and that in order to preserve our infrastructure, we must save more wealth than usual and be very careful about how we allocate the wealth we do spend.  We should not, no matter what emotional appeals are made, spend that wealth in consumption because the lower we drive our net wealth, the less wealth we will have available for investment, and the harder this recession will be to get out of.</p>
<p>All money is based on the fact that there is a value (food, a house, a factory) in the market to back it up with.  Even gold wouldn&#8217;t work in the middle of an empty plain; fiat money only works because people trust it to work as well as the real thing.  This is its downfall, because inevitably politicians will always use the fiat money system to pretend wealth that doesn&#8217;t exist, and you can only cheat reality for so long before the world catches on and erupts into chaos.</p>
<p>If you look back into history you will see that the way governments have always paid for wars and spending programs by devaluing the money supply.  We did it in the Civil War, we did it when we created the Fed and the fractional reserve system and it caused the Depression, we did it again *during* the Depression when Roosevelt confiscated the nation&#8217;s gold, we did it again when we abolished Bretton-Woods so we could inflate the money supply to pay for Vietnam and LBJ&#8217;s &#8220;Great Society&#8221;, and we&#8217;re doing it now in an attempt to cover our butts with the national debt from Iraq, Afghanistan, the housing insanity, the stimulus package, the bailouts, etc.  Having a fiat money supply is like telling the people in my allegory that they should attempt to replace their corn with sawdust, and eat that instead.  It might fill their stomachs for a while, but it won&#8217;t work forever.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8531</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 01:01:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8531</guid>
		<description>Tom, that&#039;s kind of putting the cart before the horse.  Our money was not &quot;based&quot; on a commodity standard, the commodity and the paper that represented that commodity were legally and in practice the same thing.  While it is true that even back then there was more money on deposit than gold to back it, fractional reserve systems, without being fiat, have been in existence since the days of the Templar Knights, and perhaps even before that.  And they all worked reasonably well.

You can only have fluctuations in gold prices (not gold value, only its price) when gold is no longer used as money.  How would you have a fluctuation in the value of gold against gold?  Similarly, when the value and quantity of paper currency is fixed, by law, to a certain quantity of gold, the value of neither the gold nor its paper &lt;b&gt;EQUIVALENT&lt;/b&gt; can change relative to each other, for they are, legally and practically speaking, the same thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom, that&#8217;s kind of putting the cart before the horse.  Our money was not &#8220;based&#8221; on a commodity standard, the commodity and the paper that represented that commodity were legally and in practice the same thing.  While it is true that even back then there was more money on deposit than gold to back it, fractional reserve systems, without being fiat, have been in existence since the days of the Templar Knights, and perhaps even before that.  And they all worked reasonably well.</p>
<p>You can only have fluctuations in gold prices (not gold value, only its price) when gold is no longer used as money.  How would you have a fluctuation in the value of gold against gold?  Similarly, when the value and quantity of paper currency is fixed, by law, to a certain quantity of gold, the value of neither the gold nor its paper <b>EQUIVALENT</b> can change relative to each other, for they are, legally and practically speaking, the same thing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8529</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 00:43:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8529</guid>
		<description>Well, I&#039;m still digesting the article (couldn&#039;t resist the pun), and I&#039;m not sure I see how the analogy works if money isn&#039;t based on some commodity standard (like gold, or maybe corn).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I&#8217;m still digesting the article (couldn&#8217;t resist the pun), and I&#8217;m not sure I see how the analogy works if money isn&#8217;t based on some commodity standard (like gold, or maybe corn).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Brianna</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8513</link>
		<dc:creator>Brianna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 21:22:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8513</guid>
		<description>That was me, sorry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That was me, sorry.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8512</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 21:20:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8512</guid>
		<description>&quot;Corn, of course, can’t simultaneously have commodity value and have no commodity value (ie, be credit).&quot;

Really?  Then how do you think credit worked in the 1920&#039;s when we were still on the gold standard?  Or between 1945 and 1971 when we were still kinda-sorta on the gold standard via the Bretton-Woods system.

Credit is based on the assumption that the value you are borrowing today will be paid for with future production.  Money is paid by a third party to purchase an item, and you eventually pay back that third party with interest, &#039;cause if there&#039;s no profit in loaning money, then why should I bother?  That is the same in both a commodity and a fiat system.  The only difference between a commodity and a fiat system is that a fiat system gives the government a lot more room to screw around with the money supply (which I might add, has worked out oh-so-well for our economy so far).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Corn, of course, can’t simultaneously have commodity value and have no commodity value (ie, be credit).&#8221;</p>
<p>Really?  Then how do you think credit worked in the 1920&#8242;s when we were still on the gold standard?  Or between 1945 and 1971 when we were still kinda-sorta on the gold standard via the Bretton-Woods system.</p>
<p>Credit is based on the assumption that the value you are borrowing today will be paid for with future production.  Money is paid by a third party to purchase an item, and you eventually pay back that third party with interest, &#8217;cause if there&#8217;s no profit in loaning money, then why should I bother?  That is the same in both a commodity and a fiat system.  The only difference between a commodity and a fiat system is that a fiat system gives the government a lot more room to screw around with the money supply (which I might add, has worked out oh-so-well for our economy so far).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Kevin</title>
		<link>http://opinion-forum.com/index/2009/10/eating-your-seed-corn/comment-page-1/#comment-8510</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Oct 2009 20:16:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://opinion-forum.com/index/?p=7192#comment-8510</guid>
		<description>If the money supply were still based on the Gold standard, the earlier Sherman Silver Purchase act or some comparable commodity value system then your analogy might work. Corn, of course, can&#039;t simultaneously have commodity value and have no commodity value (ie, be credit).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the money supply were still based on the Gold standard, the earlier Sherman Silver Purchase act or some comparable commodity value system then your analogy might work. Corn, of course, can&#8217;t simultaneously have commodity value and have no commodity value (ie, be credit).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

